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[Rock27]

If it doesn't clear up here on the westside, lots of icy streets everywhere, I-90 is closed - what does the state say about requiring dangerous travel to the eastside of the mountains for a state tournament game?

Seems I remember a disaster a couple of years ago, people not getting there, games forfeited, etc.  Who's got the scoop?

[Bathos]

It sounds like the roads will be open, but I'm curious what the fields are like.

Snow isn't a big deal to clear, but do they play if they're frozen?  Any dry side refs who can share a standard would be appreciated!

Edit:  Here's the WSYSA rules.  http://wsysa.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=u6jZ9MDow8A%3d&tabid=1666&mid=5070&language=en-US

[Rock27]

what is not clarified in the rules is what if you can't reschedule because of the time frame involved?  And it's one thing to get across the pass, but in our current westside situation we might not be able to get to I90 because of ice.  This will be interesting. thanks for the input.

[4soccer]

Per Email, all RCL League games and State Cup games scheduled for Saturday have been cancelled. Sunday will be evaluated on Saturday.

The weather policy for WA Youth Soccer is listed here on this link to act as a baseline for any decisions regarding travel. 

http://www.wsysa.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=u6jZ9MDow8A%3d&tabid=1622&language=en-US

 

 

Three things to consider –

1)    Field availability – the heavier snow and in most cases now with an icing sleet will make snow removal laborious and many fields may not be able to be cleared in time for matches this weekend EVEN IF the roads in Western Washington improve with the rain.  Please have your field assignors and administrators give your managers an assessment of availability that can be communicated today and tomorrow.

2)    Travel – while the roads begin to clear with the warmer temperatures, icy conditions may exist at higher elevations and make for dangerous conditions.  This does not mean that all cross–state travel is cancelled, just that DoC’s should be in discussion about reasonable travel conditions today and tomorrow to help guide their team managers’ decisions.  In terms of Cup play, please contact me ASAP if you anticipate some issues with the games being played.

3)    Available weekends (league) – also review your current schedule.  If there are available weekends, or in some cases, weeknights, rescheduling is an option.

 

Please note though, that at the request of the membership, we purposefully scheduled games so there was no extra “free” or “buffer” weekends between prelims, (round of 16, Quarters if applicable) and semis/finals weekend. We then gave the teams the flexibility to move prelim games as they saw fit. Consequently, we do not have any flexibility in pushing these round of 16 and quarterfinal matches (if applicable to your gender age group and competition) to other weekends therefore all prelim matches need to be finalized as soon as possible if the inclement weather delays games this weekend. This could mean playing mid week games. This especially applies to the last prelim games of the FOUNDERS CUP being played this weekend!

 

Please COMMUNICATE to your opponents regarding travel and field conditions! If you have any questions, please contact your Association Tournament Rep or myself.

 

[EWSoccer64]

based on history, the state will make changes/cancellations/dictates at the very last minute, and screw the Eastern Washington teams.
But that is just the pattern of behavior.

[metz123]

The state has a pretty clear policy here http://www.wsysa.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=u6jZ9MDow8A%3d&tabid=1622&language=en-US

THey've already sent out email stating that state cup elimination games will take place at the scheduled time and will not be moved. All group play must be concluded prior to the elimination games. Expect to see midweek games for teams in mid week traveling distance and double headers scheduled for those that aren't. I'm anticipating teams getting bumped off of practice fields in order to schedule games during those times and a lot of confusion. What can you do? It's the weather, it can't be controlled and you do your best to work with other teams and associations to get things in.

[Oneblindmouse]

Well, since we finally have a couple of field-turf fields over here in Spokaloo, that makes it a lot easier to still hold games.  Safety of the players is our utmost concern, and if you have traveled from the wet side of the state under less than perfect conditions I am going to lean towards allowing the game to happen.  As to what conditions I would set for determining if the field is "safe" - can you run without falling would probably be where I start.  As long as the field is clear, and the lines are visible and you an move around without immediately falling on your keester, then Play On!

It sounds like the roads will be open, but I'm curious what the fields are like.

Snow isn't a big deal to clear, but do they play if they're frozen?  Any dry side refs who can share a standard would be appreciated!

Edit:  Here's the WSYSA rules.  http://wsysa.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=u6jZ9MDow8A%3d&tabid=1666&mid=5070&language=en-US

[Bathos]

Well, since we finally have a couple of field-turf fields over here in Spokaloo, that makes it a lot easier to still hold games.  Safety of the players is our utmost concern, and if you have traveled from the wet side of the state under less than perfect conditions I am going to lean towards allowing the game to happen.  As to what conditions I would set for determining if the field is "safe" - can you run without falling would probably be where I start.  As long as the field is clear, and the lines are visible and you an move around without immediately falling on your keester, then Play On!

Thanks OBM, that was very helpful.  It's a moot point now, but I'm curious about grass fields where the ground itself is frozen.  As a kid growing up in CO I know there may not be ice or snow on the field, but you still wouldn't want to play on it since it would be like playing on concrete.  I suppose it could, in theory, happen with field turf too, but does it ever get too hard to play on?

[Oneblindmouse]

I hear you on that one, as a ref I hate running around on a hard field, hard on the ole knees...but....I would be hard pressed to suspend a game for the field being frozen, but not slick.  If both of the teams have shown up and the only issue we have is a hard frozen field, I think I might be lynched by the visiting parents if I were to suspend the game   

Thanks OBM, that was very helpful.  It's a moot point now, but I'm curious about grass fields where the ground itself is frozen.  As a kid growing up in CO I know there may not be ice or snow on the field, but you still wouldn't want to play on it since it would be like playing on concrete.  I suppose it could, in theory, happen with field turf too, but does it ever get too hard to play on?

[metz123]

Well, since we finally have a couple of field-turf fields over here in Spokaloo, that makes it a lot easier to still hold games.  Safety of the players is our utmost concern, and if you have traveled from the wet side of the state under less than perfect conditions I am going to lean towards allowing the game to happen.  As to what conditions I would set for determining if the field is "safe" - can you run without falling would probably be where I start.  As long as the field is clear, and the lines are visible and you an move around without immediately falling on your keester, then Play On!

Thanks OBM, that was very helpful.  It's a moot point now, but I'm curious about grass fields where the ground itself is frozen.  As a kid growing up in CO I know there may not be ice or snow on the field, but you still wouldn't want to play on it since it would be like playing on concrete.  I suppose it could, in theory, happen with field turf too, but does it ever get too hard to play on?

Most facilities shut down field turf when it is frozen. The plastic stands tend to break when frozen, significantly shortening the life of the field.

[Oneblindmouse]

That makes sense, but since the two new fields are actually owned by the city and not by soccer knowledgeable people....they will probably keep them open as long as the money comes in for the rent 

Well, since we finally have a couple of field-turf fields over here in Spokaloo, that makes it a lot easier to still hold games.  Safety of the players is our utmost concern, and if you have traveled from the wet side of the state under less than perfect conditions I am going to lean towards allowing the game to happen.  As to what conditions I would set for determining if the field is "safe" - can you run without falling would probably be where I start.  As long as the field is clear, and the lines are visible and you an move around without immediately falling on your keester, then Play On!

Thanks OBM, that was very helpful.  It's a moot point now, but I'm curious about grass fields where the ground itself is frozen.  As a kid growing up in CO I know there may not be ice or snow on the field, but you still wouldn't want to play on it since it would be like playing on concrete.  I suppose it could, in theory, happen with field turf too, but does it ever get too hard to play on?

Most facilities shut down field turf when it is frozen. The plastic stands tend to break when frozen, significantly shortening the life of the field.

[ThiKuBC]

If field conditions are dangerous the games are to be cancelled. That includes frozen pitches whether slick or not. If the cleats can't get grip then you are just asking for serious injury through slip or collision.

As a ref, I'd be very very careful of liability issues if you approve a game to be played on a frozen field and someone gets seriously injured.

It's always a tough call though when teams travel such a distance. The same people who would complain about going all that way for the game being cancelled are the same ones that would scream to the high heavens if someone got hurt because of field conditions though.

The worst cancellation I ever had to make was when a team drove about 1.5 hours in the early morning. They were ticked!

I've been wondering for the last few years especially why they even bother scheduling games from the 2nd week of December until the end of January. Even Feb can be bad at times and certainly heavy snow can come in March at times, but 2nd week Dec to end of Jan tends to be the coldest/worst...? So glad the elite teams here are now on a Spring to Fall calendar! Seasons shut down mid Nov to late Feb.

[Old Dog]

If field conditions are dangerous the games are to be cancelled. That includes frozen pitches whether slick or not. If the cleats can't get grip then you are just asking for serious injury through slip or collision.

As a ref, I'd be very very careful of liability issues if you approve a game to be played on a frozen field and someone gets seriously injured.

I've been wondering for the last few years especially why they even bother scheduling games from the 2nd week of December until the end of January. Even Feb can be bad at times and certainly heavy snow can come in March at times, but 2nd week Dec to end of Jan tends to be the coldest/worst...? So glad the elite teams here are now on a Spring to Fall calendar! Seasons shut down mid Nov to late Feb.

When is your High School soccer seasons. OR does not allow over lapping seasons does BC

[ThiKuBC]

Yes school season overlaps. Males are Sept-Nov, and females are spring. However, as of 2012 kickoff although players will be allowed to play other sports (with clear statement that soccer is #1) it sounds as though none in the BC Premier League will be allowed to play HS soccer due to the overlap. Kids in lower tiers would of course be free to play both. But I could be wrong - "other sports" may include playing HS soccer but that it takes back-burner to the PL team....

[Rock27]

That makes sense, but since the two new fields are actually owned by the city and not by soccer knowledgeable people....they will probably keep them open as long as the money comes in for the rent 

Well, since we finally have a couple of field-turf fields over here in Spokaloo, that makes it a lot easier to still hold games.  Safety of the players is our utmost concern, and if you have traveled from the wet side of the state under less than perfect conditions I am going to lean towards allowing the game to happen.  As to what conditions I would set for determining if the field is "safe" - can you run without falling would probably be where I start.  As long as the field is clear, and the lines are visible and you an move around without immediately falling on your keester, then Play On!

Thanks OBM, that was very helpful.  It's a moot point now, but I'm curious about grass fields where the ground itself is frozen.  As a kid growing up in CO I know there may not be ice or snow on the field, but you still wouldn't want to play on it since it would be like playing on concrete.  I suppose it could, in theory, happen with field turf too, but does it ever get too hard to play on?

Most facilities shut down field turf when it is frozen. The plastic stands tend to break when frozen, significantly shortening the life of the field.

Played on these fields last year - piles of snow on the sidelines, frozen black rubber pellets but they played.  What I don't think is fair is you travel 4 + hrs from Seattle to Spokane and the state's rules don't really talk about "unscheduled" pass closures, like avalanche control.  This weekend in particular as they are closing it intermittently when they need to.  What do you do if you get caught going over Sat or Sun even if you leave at 5 a.m. and are late and therefore, the game is a forfeit?  Don't say go over the night prior - the "tight" schedule has 2 games scheduled for the weekend.

[Bathos]

They just need to schedule these things with a certain kind of intelligence.
Summertime is beautiful in western WA, so all the games should be there,
Springtime is lovely in the fruitbelt, so all the games should be Yakima/Tri-Cities/etc,
Fall in the Palouse and eastern WA is beautiful, so games would be there,
Wintertime we'd play at "neutral" fields.  I suggest Hawaii.

 

[EWSoccer64]

They just need to schedule these things with a certain kind of intelligence.
Summertime is beautiful in western WA, so all the games should be there,
Springtime is lovely in the fruitbelt, so all the games should be Yakima/Tri-Cities/etc,
Fall in the Palouse and eastern WA is beautiful, so games would be there,
Wintertime we'd play at "neutral" fields.  I suggest Hawaii.

 

In games between EFC and Eastern Washington teams during state cup, the WYS has declared that Preston is the "neutral" site.

[Rock27]

They just need to schedule these things with a certain kind of intelligence.
Summertime is beautiful in western WA, so all the games should be there,
Springtime is lovely in the fruitbelt, so all the games should be Yakima/Tri-Cities/etc,
Fall in the Palouse and eastern WA is beautiful, so games would be there,
Wintertime we'd play at "neutral" fields.  I suggest Hawaii.

 

In games between EFC and Eastern Washington teams during state cup, the WYS has declared that Preston is the "neutral" site.

Now that's just plain dumb.  The state should work out a deal with CWU and let them use their field.  Ellensburg isn't quite halfway, but closer at least.  Can't wait to hear the decision tomorrow.

[EWSoccer64]

To play the devil's advocate, the state has a need to get the games done, to minimize disruptions, and to not upset the Big Clubs.  So they make their rescheduling decisions accordingly. 

I remember a Shadow team, I think they were U-13 boys, who flew to Seattle for a group stage game because the passes were very iffy, and stayed in a hotel the night before.   A $250 or more outing for a 60 or 70 minute outing.   With 18 players, that was very expensive soccer.   The last time one of my teams did a state cup, the state said that since the passes were closed, every game in the state that required cross pass travel was postponed.   Except ours, and only ours.   We were in the semis or quarters, and we were the only team, in any age group, that had to travel across the passes.  They opened and then would reclose.   Some players flew (but the planes were pretty much booked up).  Some went over White Pass, some via Portland, and some gambled on Snoqualmie.   We all got there, but some of us were on the road for 10 hours.....

At a certain point, the people who run these tournaments are so frazzled that they want them done and over.   "Fair" becomes just another four letter word. 
Any of the posters who have worked on many tournaments can recall instances where schedules were getting messed up, and then a game looked like it was going to go into over time.   Suddenly, there is a mad scrum in front of a goal, and the ref awards a goal!   Yeah, NO OVERTIME!   You, as the tournamend official in charge of scheduling, smile and cheer!   
So the losing team thinks that the tournament is conspiring against them, particularly since the ref missed umpteen blatant fouls in the scrum and the whole ball never crossed the line, etc............   WYS does not care about fair, they hardly care about the appearance of fair, what they want is the Big RCL Clubs to be happy, to have a minimum of changes and disruption, and for the tournaments to be OVER.   

[lester]

... the state has a need to get the games done, to minimize disruptions, and to not upset the Big Clubs.  So they make their rescheduling decisions accordingly. 

Those days are gone EWSoccer64.  That was when the Cups were organized by volunteers.  Remember, WYS created a new paid position and hired someone last summer just to run the Cups.

[EWSoccer64]

... the state has a need to get the games done, to minimize disruptions, and to not upset the Big Clubs.  So they make their rescheduling decisions accordingly. 

Those days are gone EWSoccer64.  That was when the Cups were organized by volunteers.  Remember, WYS created a new paid position and hired someone last summer just to run the Cups.

Didn't they have paid people running the cups last winter, just not specialised positions?

[Rock27]

OK WSYSA - it is now noon and whomever has to cross east/west or west/east would like to get going if tomorrow's games are on (Sunday).  Has anyone heard anything yet?  This is a bit ridiculous - almost worth paying the fine and dropping out.

[Pops]

OK WSYSA - it is now noon and whomever has to cross east/west or west/east would like to get going if tomorrow's games are on (Sunday).  Has anyone heard anything yet?  This is a bit ridiculous - almost worth paying the fine and dropping out.

Guidelines went out to all registered participants.

[Rock27]

Games are on - teams crossing back and forth all over the state.